Will Belgium win the World Cup?
Belgium are unbeaten in World Cup qualifying having won seven of their eight group games. (Getty Images)
September 10th, 2013
10:54 AM ET

Will Belgium win the World Cup?

No. But the fact that a nation with a population of just 11 million people is being mentioned as World Cup dark horses is nothing short of remarkable given Belgium have failed to qualify for their last five major tournaments.

Marc Wilmots’ side top their European qualifying group and even if they lose to Croatia in the next game, victory in their final game –- at home to Wales –- will take Belgium to the World Cup finals in Brazil next year.

The assorted talents of Vincent Kompany, Kevin De Bruyne, Eden Hazard, Simon Mignolet, Thomas Vermaelen, Marouane Fellaini, Kevin Mirallas, Romelu Lukaku, Jan Vertonghen, Moussa Dembele and Christian Benteke are players well known to English Premier League watchers.

But the depth of Wilmots’ squad is demonstrated by the likes of Atletico Madrid’s goalkeeper Thibaut Courtois - on loan from Chelsea - and defender Toby Alderweireld, Zenit St Petersburg midfielder Axel Witsel, Napoli forward Dries Mertens and Cagliari midfielder Radja Nianggolan.

“We knew Belgium had a good team,” former Standard Liege coach Jose Riga told CNN. “But the surprise has been the way the team has played game after game with a lot of maturity.

“The quality was there, but you still have to build the team and in international football you often don’t have much time. What has helped is that the players have been together for a long time and know each other very well.”

As well as developing the “skills of the future game,” Riga believes the presence of “good men” has been key to Belgium’s success.

“In any story you need role models and examples,” said Riga, who made specific mention of Kompany and Hazard.

“By nature, the Belgium guys are humble. We don’t have the same mentality as the Dutch. They have quality, but they speak about it as well. In Belgium we are more introverted.

“But our players have gone to many countries and they have often transferred to big clubs at an early age, which is invaluable in gaining experience.”

Coach pays price for Mexico struggles

England’s Football Association, which recently created a commission to examine the dearth of English players available to international coach Roy Hodgson, could be forgiven a tinge of envy at the depth of talent that is rolling off Belgium’s player production line.

On Friday, Belgium’s Under-21 side beat Italy 3-1 with a side that was so good that Anderlecht’s highly-rated 19-year-old Dennis Praet started on the bench.

Even younger is 17-year-old PSV Eindhoven striker Zakaria Bakkali, who in August became the youngest player to score a hat-trick in the Dutch league and is so talented that Wilmots is ready to fast track the youngster into his squad. Only injury robbed the youngster of the opportunity to make his full international debut against France last month.

“Some 13 years ago the Belgian Football Federation decided to reorganize Belgian football programs and set up in every province an elite academy,” leading Belgium youth football coach Michel Bruyninckx, who has long been interested in maximizing the way players use their brain in games as part of his innovative training sessions, told CNN.

“In collaboration with all the universities in our country and after studying the strategies of other countries the Belgian FA composed a plan with the new vision implemented in the different federation academies and then step-by-step integrated in the club programs.

“Just as importantly the Ministry of Education agreed to create a school curriculum to extend the number of weekly training hours.

“That meant we could guarantee young talents would have about 20 hours training time a week and their school programs were never in danger.

"The structure, organization and lifestyle in the academies was regularly checked to make sure that this project delivered professional players or highly qualified young people.”

This season Belgium's leading club side Anderlecht will compete in the Champions League with a squad that has an average age of just 22.5 years. One of Bruyninckx’s close confidants Dirk Gyselinckx is working with the Anderlecht youth teams which have been dominating at both national and international level.

“Anderlecht have won five of the eight national youth championships and many important European tournaments such as the Viareggio, the Aegon Future Cup and the Premier League Cup,” added Bruyninckx.

“The integration of many very young players in the first team is the proof of the success of what has happened in Belgium. Most of all Yoeri Tielemans, the 16 year-old player, who has surprised the whole of Belgium and is the product of the new strategy.”

Riga stressed that while the Belgian Federation had looked at the way other nations developed players, it had not simply “copied and pasted” what had worked in those countries.

“There’s no point in copying Spain," said Riga. "The education system is different as is the weather and culture, but it is good to open your eyes and try to understand these approaches.”

The former Standard Liege coach also warned that Belgium must not rest on its laurels.

“It’s a never ending story," added Riga. "You have to constantly search for the evolution of football. The coach has to anticipate the future game and if you want to have some advantages you have to try and anticipate to find the key to football success.”

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soundoff (51 Responses)
  1. highperformance14

    Reblogged this on Highperformancecoaching and commented:
    Football news for the day

    September 10, 2013 at 12:09 pm | Reply
  2. Footy6

    "the fact that a nation with a population of just 11 million people"

    Uruguay has 3 million...

    September 10, 2013 at 1:54 pm | Reply
    • CH

      Uruguay is below Belgium on the FIFA ranking... 😉

      September 11, 2013 at 10:09 am | Reply
      • Daddy

        But Uruguay won 2 world cups, 2 Olympic Games, was 4th in last World Cup, is the present America´s Champion (4th time) and his teams Nacional and Peñarol won countless world club championships including 4 Toyota Cups. All with 3 million people. Sorry for you son.

        September 14, 2013 at 7:18 pm |
    • John Horne

      Portugal only has 10 million

      September 14, 2013 at 10:02 am | Reply
      • 1000dB

        Look at Blondo's comments. He has opened my eyes.

        September 21, 2013 at 6:04 am |
  3. Wim

    Our last game is at home against Wales, not Scotland. Bakkali hasn't made his debut yet because he isn't sure if he wants to play for Belgium or Morocco, not so much because of an injury. No mention of Ferreira-Carrasco, really? And i do believe in our chances at this world cup. Even more so because after tonight, we'll be ranked 5th or 6th on Fifa's ranking, which should ensure a favourable draw in the group stages. Once you make it past that stage, there's no telling where you might end up. Boils down to the form of the day really. Winning the world cup might require a bit of luck, but I've little doubt we can finish top 8.

    [EDITOR'S NOTE: We have amended the Wales/Scotland reference – thanks to those who pointed it out)

    September 10, 2013 at 3:19 pm | Reply
    • Chris

      I totally agree Wim. About winning the world cup, I also would say that we need a correct arbitration. Remember 2002 and the match vs Brazil. The outcome of the match would have been different if we had led 1-0 after Wilmots's goal unfairly canceled ... And it's not first time that a "giant" is favored by arbitration when in danger ...

      September 10, 2013 at 6:55 pm | Reply
      • marcelo

        Chris you're right about goal denied of Wilmots, it was simply ridiculous, as ridiculous was Brazil in the 98 final match. According internet emails, it was a part of major agreement Nike Addidas (France 98 Brazil 2002).
        By the way can you tell me how South Korea defeats Italy in the same WC? It was the same referee???? kkkkk
        good luck and welcome to Brazil

        September 11, 2013 at 12:57 pm |
      • Wim

        Every Belgian remembers that infamous disallowed goal, don't we 🙂 Although arguably, we're not a 'small' country anymore and most of our players are dominant individuals in top competitions. So if anything, I think referees will be more inclined to be more favorable to us (even though Tagliavento clearly wasn't, what was that yellow card for Fellaini about??). I don't think you can blame everything on the referee though either. To win a world cup you need 1. a great team and 2. little moments of luck like for example referees decisions going your way. We already have a great team, we now just need that bit of luck.

        September 11, 2013 at 1:39 pm |
  4. Kris

    Nice analysis, but I agree with Wim: why the "No"? This team has the potential to win the World Cup, period. That answer does not have any foundation. Anything is possible, if you think about the progress this team has made – and is making.

    September 10, 2013 at 5:22 pm | Reply
  5. Lala

    In short, NO!

    September 10, 2013 at 6:24 pm | Reply
    • Potomac89

      YES! They can! they have it all

      September 14, 2013 at 7:04 pm | Reply
      • Lala

        They have it all? Hahahaha. You're delusional. Belgium better than the Netherlands? You Belgians aren't right in the head.

        September 15, 2013 at 12:31 am |
  6. Chris

    Will Belgium win the World Cup?
    No ? who knows ?
    Of course you need to be a great country to get a referee blowing for your side...
    as Belgium experienced it in 1994 agianst Germany and in 2002 against Brazil..(penalty refused,// a goal denied)..small countries are not to be favoured..on the countrary..
    But on basis of the quality of the squad, Belgium is one of the countries on which you could easily bet on!!!-

    September 10, 2013 at 8:12 pm | Reply
  7. lambandbert


    Both are great articles. Both go indepth on the development of the Belgian FA and footballers. Both should be read.

    September 10, 2013 at 11:21 pm | Reply
  8. Tim

    If Netherlands cannot win it in all these years (they have come close twice), then Belgium is not going to win.

    September 11, 2013 at 12:09 am | Reply
    • martijn

      If Netherlands cannot win it in all these years (they have come close twice), then Belgium is not going to win."

      Ehr, the Netherlands were finalists 3 times actually.....
      There is no relation/causality between hollands past chances and belgiums current chance..

      Any country that qualifies for the end tournament has a chance, and so does Belgium when they qualify.
      The belgian team is very strong and i wish them all the best.

      September 11, 2013 at 12:46 pm | Reply
    • Wim

      Nonsensical comparison. That's like saying Italy didn't win last time so now Portugal has no chance. The Netherlands didn't beat Estonia last week. Does that mean Belgium couldn't come out on top against them? Hardly.

      September 11, 2013 at 1:34 pm | Reply
      • 1000dB

        Tim's knowledge of Oranje's legacy is admirable. In 1974 Belgium should have qualified instead of Holland. Tim correctly ignores that World Cup and this feeling is even shared on Dutch sites, e.g. onsoranje. So the Dutch actually did come close twice, i.e. 1978 and 2010, and both times because of Sam Allardyce style football. Nigel De Jong has become a more recent incarnation of how the Dutch are able to break into the upper echelons ... please ask X.Alonso, Ben Arfa, Stuart Holden, etc. if destroyer-type players add to the beautiful game or instead take away some of the beauty.

        Neither total football nor 'Ollandse School' has been the driving force in the Dutch squad, unless it means having a major in hard tackling that cause total loss accidents. The Brazilians have had the most success in World Cup history and are known for joga bonito. Yet every cup that the Brazilians have taken home with them, has been mainly the merit of their world class defenders. Still we only remember the "samba moments" because those are the ones featured on highlights and selected by our memories.

        September 21, 2013 at 3:46 am |
  9. rodrihoo

    no, also means that belgium could be at the podium of the worldcup,

    September 11, 2013 at 12:54 pm | Reply
  10. Jan

    They will not win it in 2014 – I looked at all their matches and I fear Belgium lacks a real "killer" in front (however, best attacking midfield I have seen in years...)- but if this (still very) young generation progresses as it has done the last few years, Russia 2018 might be a very interesting place for the Belgians...

    Winning in Croatia is not required, but might be important for their FIFA -ranking. Wales – even with Mr. Bale – seems no match for the Belgians.

    September 11, 2013 at 6:30 pm | Reply
    • Potomac89

      benteke and lukaku? lack a killer?

      September 14, 2013 at 7:03 pm | Reply

    Reblogged this on miftahulhuda234.

    September 11, 2013 at 6:46 pm | Reply
  12. Gemu

    Belgium now has the quality to take on any team in the world and win the game. I'm not saying they will win something but every match needs to be played and anything can happen. If you look at the teams they play for and take into account that they are all decisive players at their team, anybody who knows anything about football knows they can take on Germany, Spain or Brazil any day and put up a decent fight. I'm quite sure all the international teams take Belgium very serious when they're up against them and it will be a difficult time to score against the Belgians. I think they have one of the strongest defense in the world, combine that with their offensive powerplay and you have a real though game ahead of you...

    September 11, 2013 at 6:49 pm | Reply
  13. Georges Jean

    Belgium may reach a strong quarterfinal, along with England. The potential squads such as Netherlands, Germany, and Uruguay are more pinpoint to win over the 2014 WC. Moreover, Brazil can only triumph according to Group stage because that was evidenced in the Confederations, where Spain terribly failed the test contending with Brazil. To me, either Germany or Netherlands will clinch the Cup.

    September 12, 2013 at 4:02 am | Reply
    • Potomac89

      belgium are better then the netherlands

      September 14, 2013 at 7:02 pm | Reply
    • Sean

      No european team has won outside of europe, ever!...dont think it will be this time either, even though Germany look hot favourites...

      September 14, 2013 at 8:51 pm | Reply
      • Marc 58

        No, but there's always a first time. But Brazil will play the final, that's for sure. And don't underastimate the USA, they're bound to be world champions one day, altough I hope Belguim will be world champion (if the country still excists).

        September 15, 2013 at 3:13 am |
      • Blondo

        Remember South Africa 2010? Only Uruguay reached the semifinals (and then lost 3th place final to Germany):

        1. Spain
        2. Holland
        3. Germany

        Also I feel that during Brazil 2014 South American teams will have a lot of difficulty replicating the European domination of Germany 2006 (semifinals were an European affaire). It's more likely that there will be 3 European teams in the semifinals then 3 South American.

        September 16, 2013 at 8:15 am |
  14. Boris

    There is a chance we will win the World Cup, but it is rather small. Everyone's excited because we might turn out being group winners of our pre-qualification pool, yet the teams in our pool are weak to mediocre. Belgium has yet not shown any credibility winning against big European teams in years. In recent friendly's we were not able to beat UK or even France at home ground. I hope we quickly qualify, being able to participate Brazil will be good fun.

    September 14, 2013 at 7:44 am | Reply
  15. MarkusTech

    Any team can contest for the title of being dubbed world cup champions but it takes a special team of players to really lift that trophy. Individuals playing in competitive leagues around the world surely is not enough to ensure or regard belgium as world cup contenders. For e.g. Take england for instance, a really talented group of individuals with the likes of gerrard, lampard, rooney. All powerful household names at their respective clubs who failed to muster the very same spark at the world cup. All im saying is they might have an array of talented players but them alone is not enough to guarantee success at the WC depending on how you define success of course. I just think belgium is not a well established side to be even regarded as quarterfinal material. But then again we're talking about the WC here. There are bound to be surprises and them reaching the quarterfinal would be one heck of a surprise!

    September 14, 2013 at 8:36 am | Reply
  16. jverstry

    Belgium needs a tie to be qualified. A loss does not mathematically guarantee we would be qualified.... (though it would remain very likely).

    September 14, 2013 at 2:59 pm | Reply
  17. Potomac89

    No? When you have a team that is as stacked as Belgium to say simply no they won't win it is crap! they are loaded in every position and an amazing amount of depth! don't tell me they can't win it!!!

    September 14, 2013 at 7:02 pm | Reply
  18. Sean

    Portugal has 10 million...two semi finals, one final...population not a factor when it comes to sports...All blacks in rugby, uruguay in football, canada in ice hockey etc etc

    September 14, 2013 at 8:54 pm | Reply
  19. Craig I

    Perhaps not...but I put 50 on them at 35-1.......Good odds in my opinion....

    September 15, 2013 at 2:02 am | Reply
  20. Blondo

    Population does matter when it comes to the World Cup. Uruguay has won 2 cups and is the exception to the rule that only big countries win the World Cup. Still are those trophies as shiny as the ones that came after those victories? At that time sports was a privilege of "subsidised amateurs" and the elite. The tournament itself wasn't a big hit and countries often dropped out for reasons that have little to do with the beautiful game. This lasted untill the late 50s or even 60s. At the advent of mass consumerism we also saw the World Cup slowly develop into the "finished" article of these days.

    Argentina, Brazil, Spain and Germany are without a shadow of a doubt the frontrunners for Brazil 2014. Again these are all big countries. Of the smaller ones Belgium definitely has the best odds to go all the way. I would even bet that they are the dark horse par excellence and rank them 5th behind the 4 football superpowers.

    Holland is still a marquee name and a team that is feared by most of their opponents. However to be called a true outsider they currently lack the quality that they usually can boast about. Nevertheless with this squad Van Gaal has already performed better than during his 2002 campaign. Portugal and Uruguay are the other 2 small countries that have a decent shot, although these teams are less likely to lift up the coveted cup in the end. I'd rank them on the same level as France, behind Colombia, England and the Netherlands while Italy is another outsider like Belgium.

    September 16, 2013 at 10:21 am | Reply
  21. Fabio

    I read in all these comments that Portugal, Colombia, England are favourite respect Italy... History is important in football... What did England win? only one world championship (England '66) than nothing... Colombia and Portugal??? I remember to all of you that Italy reached 2nd place in the last european championship (beating Germany and England) and this summer reached 3rd place in Confederations Cup...

    September 17, 2013 at 7:46 pm | Reply
  22. Blondo

    My previous comment mainly addressed the World Cup legacy of countries with a relatively small population. Yet I could have stated more clearly that since the late 50s to 60s, when the World Cup had adequately matured, only big countries have lifted the cup.

    Only countries with a population of 40 million or more have been victorious at the last 15 World Cups. The frontrunners for Brazil 2014 are again 4 big countries and outsider Italy is another big country to be favoured over e.g. Portugal. Still what I tried to get across was that population has been a factor in recent World Cup history. At least it has been a factor in the past 63 years and the odds are that it remains the same in Brazil 2014.

    Italy and Belgium are 2 teams that are more or less favoured over the likes of Colombia, England, Holland, Portugal, France, etc. Both are dark horses and according to the bookmakers they are neck and neck. Unlike Belgium, Italy is a big country, their pedigree is beyond reproach and in the most recent tournaments they've often stayed in the race for the cup. Nevertheless I'm betting Belgium will be better.

    Belgium has the best record in the European qualifiers and they achieved that in a group that contains 2 other teams that had decent odds to qualify, i.e. Croatia from pot 1 and Serbia from pot 2, ... even the groups minnow, Wales, has a player worth 100 million euros and who's currently the topscorer in group A. All opponents in the group of Italy, group B, were definitely weaker than Croatia (the odds are that the worst runner-up will come from group B or E). Belgium even shredded the Serbian defense which on paper and on grass is one of the most solid (0-3 in an away game and they netted 2 more in Brussels). Noone in group B has a defense that comes close to Serbian steel: Ivanovic (Chelsea), Subotic (Dortmund), Vidic (Man Utd), Nastasic (Man City), Kolarov (Man City), etc.

    I could go on but it suffices to say that if Belgium has no chance, the same can be said of Italy, Holland, Colombia, England, Portugal, France, Uruguay, etc. In that case let's just skip ahead to the semi-finals and let the 4 football superpowers decide which of them will win the World Cup.

    September 19, 2013 at 3:54 am | Reply
    • Georges Jean

      While I tend to agree with a large part of your assertions regarding the 2014 plausible World Cup winner, I believe that Germany, Netherlands, Brazil, and Spain may get to the semifinals, and Germany may stun Brazil whether there will be a contention with these two heavyweight squads!

      September 19, 2013 at 5:32 pm | Reply
  23. Georges Jean

    Indeed, the football powerhouse World squads such as Germany and Argentina, just to name these two, will shake the 2014 World Cup. In this point, the countries with a major population have a role in terms of winning the World Cup; Brazil, e.g., is a heavyweight in population, but Brazil may only past a rigorous quarterfinal; the defensive Brazilian still is not pure when compared to even the Serbian's defensive formation, which, in 2010, was to the point. One cannot spurn Netherlands because they gave Brazil a hard time in the 2010 quarterfinals, and they played the final with Spain!

    September 19, 2013 at 5:13 pm | Reply
  24. yan

    a team of a country with a population of 314 MILLION has not won the world cup (US). So what do you say about that? Way to use that as an arugument. Lame.

    September 19, 2013 at 8:39 pm | Reply
  25. Blondo

    Yan, I didn't assert that behemoth countries have difficulty lifting the world cup, nor that it is easy. Instead I've tried to address Sean's comments. Firstly he already had forgotten that in 2010 Spain had won the World Cup on foreign soil and secondly his argument that relatively small countries rival or are even better than football superpowers, as far as the World Cup is concerned, seems fallacious. *Portugal also has never reached the World Cup final, but he probably meant runners-up at EURO2004 in their own country.

    About a behemoth like the USA: on a wiki list of countries by population the USA is ranked 3th. Have a guess which country is ranked 5th on that list. It's another behemoth and that country boasts the most successful national team ever ... Brazil. OK the USMT's legacy is limited. Still they've reached the quarter-finals in 2002 and in those wacky ol' cups managed to come in 3th. Looking at current trends in the USA, they might soon be a real contender.

    If you like extremes, let's quickly compare the USA, 3th on that list, with its counterpart at the bottom, i.e. Vatican City. Unless Vatican City is blessed by divine intervention and enters UEFA with a generation of priests that can easily beat Messi, Ronaldo, Cavani, Hazard, Bale, etc., I don't see them lifting the world cup in the forseeable future. Who knows what will happen in the distant future. Maybe by then the EU enters a national team, selecting the best players in Germany, Spain, Italy, etc. ... at least in that case players like Bale (Welsh NT) have a shot at World Cup glory.

    PS since the World Cup matured, all winners can be found in the top half of that wiki list and the population estimations of those countries are well above average. In the bottom half there are still a few competitive teams, i.e. Uruguay, Croatia, Bosnia, etc. Oddly those countries used to be part of a much bigger country.

    September 21, 2013 at 5:58 am | Reply
  26. Dr. Cajetan Coelho

    Marc Wilmots, the football manager of the Red Devils is blessed with a galaxy of top class keepers, defenders, midfielders and strikers. If the likes of Lukaku, Dembele, Benteke, Chadli, Marouanne continue their scoring spree there could certainly be a new claimant for a respectable podium finish.

    October 6, 2013 at 11:30 am | Reply
  27. Daniel

    There are a series of referee decisions that have plagued the Red Devils over the years.
    In 1970 at the world cup a South American ref awarded Mexico a penalty on a tackle that was clearly legal and tactfully executed by the Belgian Defense. Mexico score and Belgium were out .
    The 1974 game with the Netherlands , Belgium score late goal was , offside flag ruled no goal, yet replays show it was a good goal final 0-0 Netherlands go to World Cup
    1986, The Red Devils verses Argentina, the Portuguese Linesmen flagging 2 offsides that the replay clearly shows Belgian players on side. The most blatant one was on Danny Veyt who subsequently received a yellow card. Had the Red Devils converted one of those chances perhaps things would have been different.Referee was from Mexico, a Spanish speaking country.
    1994 Belgium verses Germany, Josip Weber brought down in the area, everyone seem to know it was a penalty but the Swiss Ref, who was later sent home .
    2002, Marc Wilmot's scores a wonderful header and the goal is disallowed by the Jamaican Ref Belgium Vrs Brazil.

    October 7, 2013 at 12:35 am | Reply
  28. Daniel


    The 1974 game with the Netherlands , Belgium score late goal was , offside flag ruled no goal, yet replays show it was a good goal final 0-0 Netherlands go to World Cup

    If you pause it at the time the ball is touched or played you will see that the Belgian player was on side and it was a good goal

    October 7, 2013 at 1:08 am | Reply
  29. Daniel

    1986, The Red Devils verses Argentina, the Portuguese Linesmen flagging 2 offsides that the replay clearly shows Belgian players on side. The most blatant one was on Danny Veyt who subsequently received a yellow card. Had the Red Devils converted one of those chances perhaps things would have been different.Referee was from Mexico, a Spanish speaking country.

    October 7, 2013 at 1:20 am | Reply
  30. Daniel

    1994 Belgium verses Germany, Josip Weber brought down in the area, everyone seem to know it was a penalty but the Swiss Ref, who was later sent home .

    October 7, 2013 at 1:21 am | Reply
  31. Daniel


    2002, Marc Wilmot's scores a wonderful header and the goal is disallowed by the Jamaican Ref Belgium Vrs Brazil.
    Wilmots is our leader !!

    October 7, 2013 at 1:26 am | Reply
  32. Daniel


    n 1970 at the world cup a South American ref awarded Mexico a penalty on a tackle that was clearly legal and tactfully executed by the Belgian Defense. Mexico score and Belgium were out

    October 8, 2013 at 3:03 am | Reply
  33. Rob

    @1000db, sept 21:
    What a nonsensical comment. No-one who follows football in the Netherlands feels that the 1974 WC result should not count.

    The Netherlands SHOULD have qualified for 2002 and for the EC 1984. But they didn't. We don't count those results. We do count 1974 and rightly so.

    Anyone with a bit of knowledge of WC and Dutch football would know that even after 2010 the Dutch look upon 1974 their benchmark for WC performances.

    Referee's errors, suspect other games that influence whether a team qualifies or not, are a fact of life and 'should have' does not count.

    @Blondo, sept 19:
    I think you'll find that (even at the time of you posting that) both Germany and the Netherlands had/have a slightly better record. Now, all three are on 8 wins 1 draw. Dutch GD: 27(32-5), German GD 24 (31-7).
    Belgium GD 14 (17-3).

    October 14, 2013 at 1:47 pm | Reply

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